Carrying weight

[Jebcool]

I have found (as I'm sure many others have) that our rather limited carrying capacity is quite a hinderance. I kill 1 deer and the stuff I get off him equals a 3rd of my total.

Definantly need a way to increase capacity.

My ideas are:

A craftable backpack. Or satchel or something. And this doesn't give us more than 10 or so extra weight.

A craftable sled. This sled will be small enough that the player can pull it. And have a little box on it that can store about 50lbs. However it will slow the players movement, especially when going uphill or when walking over objects not covered in snow/ice.

Any other thoughts?

[JohnOttway]

I think that adding a backpack or satchel shouldn't be able to increase your carrying load, as it wouldn't in real life. You would just be carrying the same wait in a different bag.

As far as a sled or something to push stuff around in, why not? The more options for survival, the better! However, It should be balanced, more weight on a sled or whatever that you would push you around would fatigue you quicker and make you need more calories and water while you were working.

There are cars in the game that I have found, what if they added a way to repair the cars so that you can drive supplies around, at the price of gasoline that you would have to find.

[selfless]

Limited carry capacity is a feature. Simulates real life in which you must choose what to carry.

If the only time you're thinking "should I have this in my inventory?" is when you can no longer move, you are doing it wrong. Prompt decision making is key. Some things need be left behind.

[Jebcool]

My thought with the backpack was that it's easier to carry weight distributed than holding it. For example when I put 30 lbs in a backpack (such as books for school) it's actually rather easy to carry.

And yes the sled would have to be limited so as not to provide too much. Mostly for moving from one location to the next, without having to leave all your hides and food behind. Or used for gathering wood or meat. I think it should make the player slower for sure and take more calories and energy to use. It should also increase the range for animals to detect you, making it harder to hunt prey animals and avoid predator animals.

Maybe instead of a backpack system there should be some sort of physical fitness level. Like keeping your guy fed and rested makes him stronger and makes his muscles grow and thus increase how much he can carry.

[Amazombie]

sled would be awesome. Personally I wish the would spend time on adding things like that instead of new areas and area specific crafting like the forge, which is pointless if you are in ML and dont want to risk a long run just to get there.

[Jebcool]

Exactly. And I would love a system like the sled that would allow for my to transport all my hides and such to a new area,instead of leaving everything behind

[HarliKatt]

I see the need for limitation as well but, when just your clothing takes up half of the available carry weight, it seems almost too limited, and not fun in the interest of gameplay. Obviously, we're all making it work currently but just making it work, for some of us I feel, isn't cutting it. I think I see the carry weight discussion so often and it seems to be fairly evenly divided on those that think it's appropriate as is, and those who would like to see more options in terms of balance and tuning.

One suggestion I saw.. somewhere, might've been steam forums at one point, that really made sense to me was to have clothing weigh more in the pack but less when worn. Or rather, it affects your carry weight differently based on the utilization. Pants are just dead weight, rolled up in your pack, it's going to be more of a burden than it would be distributed more evenly across your lower body.

I also would like to see the addition of a gear sled. Not for consistent, daily use but I believe it could have some very positive situational applications. I've run into situations many times where I'll have days upon days of weather conditions that make it hazardous to go out in. Huge kudos on the most recent update that makes weather more easily readable, but, I can't count on one hand the times I've been processing an animal corpse and been caught out in the bad because it simply took too long. Being able to drag that corpse back to my base with me would be invaluable. Being able to go out and gather enough timber to keep a fire burning for days in one run would be incredibly useful. I can't begin to tell you how amazing having a sled would be for relocating a home base from region to region would be if for no other reason than cutting down the number of trips it takes to transfer belongings.

Perhaps a compromise would be disabling the ability to sprint while dragging the sled all while tiring slightly faster, making your hunger and thirst increase at an elevated rate as well. Maybe it enables you to carry an extra 20-25kg and once you reach 30, you're stuck at snail-pace.

[selfless]

...I can't count on one hand the times I've been processing an animal corpse and been caught out in the bad because it simply took too long. Being able to drag that corpse back to my base with me would be invaluable...

But that is the game. There is no other. Decision. Consequences. Choose.

Stay, freeze, but get the precious calories. Or retreat, get warm, hope for better weather next outing.

Everything else is just the environmental set up this very situation. Why destroy that?

It's a survival game, not an adventure game. Lighten your load.

[HarliKatt]

I don't completely disagree with you, Selfless. It does always come down to making choices. As it was, I dumped the wood I was carrying to be able to pick up the meat from the found carcass. If the weather patterns were readable at that time, the sky would have started to get murky and I would have known a storm was coming in and probably would have harvested only half and chosen to leave the rest behind.

I will disagree that it's not an adventure game though. I think the adventure part is intertwined with the survival. Also, I'm not such an unrepentant packrat that I carry EVERYTHING with me when I go somewhere. But pack ratting has served me very well in times when I find myself stuck somewhere for days of storms.

I'm not sure a sled would destroy the game. I think that may be a tad dramatic. I just simply said it would be nice to have that choice. For people like me, I'd often choose to use it over not using it. But would I always drag the thing around? No. Thus far, Hinterland has proven to be one of the most responsive game companies I've ever encountered. They listen to feedback from their customers, engage us on a frequent basis in conversation, take our ideas and wishes into account. But in the end, this is their game. The decisions they make are not without purpose and direction. If they add a sled, it will have been because they feel they can add one with appropriate limitations that still fits their directional intent. They certainly won't purposefully put something in to break their own game.

[Jebcool]

I agree with a lot of this. My biggest problem is I'll leave my house with basically nothing but a rifle and the clothes on my back. Plus a knife and a hatchet. And two logs or one kill later I'm full up? It's extremely limiting. In a real life situation like this any sane person would think of building a sled to lessen their carry load and allow them to make large gathering trips to store up their storage of meat or wood. It's just simple survival. You see them do it on survival shows all the time.

Yes you shouldn't be able to sprint. Yes you should to te quicker. Yes you should get hungry and thirst qyicker. It just makes sense.

But it also makes a lot of sense to have the sled. I've seen bear grills make a sled to carry his goods from one camp sight to the next, and not necessarily just in cold weather enviroments.

I think the essance of this game is survival. And every survival situation has a way to ease your need for survival. What would you do in the frozen wilderness? You wouldn't want to leave all your food or logs behind when you need to move on to a new area, you would come up with a way to transport it.

Just like we have a snare to ease the hunting of rabbits.

I would also like to point out that the sled should be difficult to make. I was thinking several logs needed and several hides and a few guts. As well as a hatchet and a knife to creates

Example:

Small sled = 8 fir/cedar logs. 2 deer hides. 4 guts. Hatchet and knife, maybe simple tools

---- gives the user 30 lbs sled weight

Large sled = 12 fir/cedar logs. 4 deer hides (or 1-2 bear hides). 8 guts. Simple tools, hatchet, knife.

---- gives the user 50 lbs sled weight

And both require maintenance, usually in the form of wooden repairs, and the more damaged they are the more they slow you down and tire you out.

[thinair]

To me never was a problem for daily life, and like 99% of the game. Since my overall exploring/hunting weight is around 14kg, i'm fine. Only one problem occurs once i have to move from map to map... which is almost never a problem because i stay in one map only, on stalker, due to game being too easy. Only was annoying when started a new run in CH just to unlock DP, so spend like 20 days in ch so had a good start, and then moved to dp, which was a pain in the behind, because had ~60 kg of stuff in ch, and i never go over 35 carrying weight, so i guess sled would of been nice. But yeah its all about playing style, and i guess most of the players do need more carrying weight.

So +1 for a sled, or at least make clothing not to be accountable to the weight, or make it accountable just a little bit, because clothing is contributed more evenly on the body so weight becomes more less of an issue.

[brun]

I like the idea to let your calorie intake influence on how much you can carry around. At the moment I can easily maintain my health eating 600-800 calories a day. Walking 5 km through snow with 30 kg should be more punishing?

[Jebcool]

I get that the game is meant to be difficult. Survival itself is difficult. But when you stay in one place long enough and gather more and more materials it's naturally going to get easier. And you would find ways to make it easier. It just makes sense to me

[selfless]

We have already seen many implementations where travelling light and managing fatigue and stamina benefit the character. Look at the bounty of resources as opportunity to not carry so much as you explore. Harvest only what you need only when you need it. Cache items for easy retrieval when needed. Become strategic. Such play can only benefit when travel becomes necessity instead of luxury.

[Spottdrossel]

I see the need for limitation as well but, when just your clothing takes up half of the available carry weight, it seems almost too limited, and not fun in the interest of gameplay.

That's a bit of an exaggeration:

The heaviest complete clothing set is

[table=][tr=][td=]Wolfskin Coat[/td][td=]3.0 kg[/td][/tr]

[tr=][td=]Deerskin Pants[/td][td=]2.0 kg[/td][/tr]

[tr=][td=]Insulated Boots[/td][td=]2.0 kg[/td][/tr]

[tr=][td=]Heavy Wool Sweater[/td][td=]0.5 kg[/td][/tr]

[tr=][td=]Wool Long Underwear [/td][td=]0.5 kg[/td][/tr]

[tr=][td=]Rabbitskin Mitts[/td][td=]0.4 kg[/td][/tr]

[tr=][td=]Basic Wool Scarf[/td][td=]0.25 kg[/td][/tr]

[tr=][td=]Toque[/td][td=]0.25 kg[/td][/tr][/table]

For a total of 8.9 kg - not even 30% of your total weight limit.

Deerskin Boots are even lighter, saving another 0.5 kg, resulting in exactly 28%.

My biggest problem is I'll leave my house with basically nothing but a rifle and the clothes on my back. Plus a knife and a hatchet. And two logs or one kill later I'm full up?

Using the numbers from above, if we add one Hatchet (1.5 kg), one Knife (0.5 kg) and one Rifle (4 kg + ammo) we're at 15/14.5 kg, leaving room for additional 15/15.5 kg.

That's far more than 2 logs (2 Fir are 2kg, 2 Cedar are 1 kg).

It's enough for harvesting a complete deer and still walk away with weight to spare.

Either you're equipping more than you admit or you're actually picking up way more than you think.

Switching to some lighter counterparts (Cargo Pants 0.5 kg, Down Ski Jacket 0.5 kg) can drop the weight of your closing below 5 kg.

You won't be able to stay out in the cold that long, but for a hunting/looting trip those 4 kg make a lot of a difference.

[Jra]

What spottdrossel said, much exaggeration. I only have problems when I am moving camp.

I do think it is silly how little can be carried though. I am an adult male and can easily carry a bag 30kg heavy on my back, not counting my clothing or shoes. And do so all day. I think the clothing in body shouldn't count and then keep the bag at thirty, or increase the carry limit.

[HyperMoon]

I think there should definitely be backpacks that you can find or craft increase your total carrying weight. It only makes sense. Although I still think space should be limiting and realistic.

[4Doose]

I find the carry weight reasonable. Load up a backpack with 65 pounds of gear and try and run with it. I think the game is VERY generous with the speed and distance you can run with full weight. Even at the top of my game long ago in the Infantry, running with a ruck sack was not a happy event. A road march was not fun. At the peak of fitness and with all the food you could want it gets old marching level ground with a full pack. Now add onto that deep snow and no snowshoes.

If you have ever hunted and dressed out a deer, you have some weight on your hands. Even if you went all the way back to your truck or camp and left everything non essential, you are still toting some poundage. All the meat plush a full hide. You are disgusting and tired. Now you gotta lump that back from god knows where. No ATV to zoom in and out with here.

Im good with the weight. Its all about resource management. Rest, food, weather, gear and time. Cant have it all.

[Jebcool]

What spottdrossel said, much exaggeration. I only have problems when I am moving camp.

I do think it is silly how little can be carried though. I am an adult male and can easily carry a bag 30kg heavy on my back, not counting my clothing or shoes. And do so all day. I think the clothing in body shouldn't count and then keep the bag at thirty, or increase the carry limit.

Agreed. I've been carrying 30lb backpacks since middle school

[tortuosit]

As for what @OP write, I was thinking the oppossite . If I am on my 7-10 day trips through the European Alps, ~8kg backpack weight is ideal and it is what people often agree they should carry. Never more than 10kg. 30 would kill me, haha. But OK, TLD is not about walking up 1500 m/height per day.

[Muk_Pile]

Well, if we can't build and use a sled to help lighten our load, then how about using that branch lying on the ground by your feet as a walking staff?

After doing a brief amount of research, I found an article that cited a 1981 study proving that using a pair of ski poles while trekking on level ground reduced the amount of weight carried by one's legs by 5% and up to 8% when moving uphill! That's an extra 1.5 to 2.4 kg (3.3 to 5.3 lbs) you could be carrying without becoming overburdened; about 2 extra cedar logs you could shove into your backpack and not feel tired hauling around.

So, here's how I envision the concept would be implemented into the game:

Walking Staff

• Craftable: Requires 1 branch and 15 minutes to craft by hand (5 with hatchet or hunting knife)
  
• Weighs 0.5 kgs (1.1 lbs)
  
• Pros: (When equipped)
  
  • Increases load limit by 2 kgs (4.4 lbs), after accounting for it's own weight
    
  • Slightly increases walking speed (~5% base speed)
    
  • Slightly reduces chances of spraining ankle or wrist while hiking (~5% base chance)
    
  • Can be used to scare of wolves (similar to a light torch, but 80% less effective)
    
  • Can be used as a weapon when fighting wolves (+5% effectiveness, same as crowbar)
    
  • Can be harvested for 2 sticks

  [*]Cons: (When equipped)

  • Does not increase sprinting speed
    
  • Slightly increases calorie burn rate while moving (~5% base calorie burn)
    
  • Slightly increases fatigue rate while moving (~5%)
    
  • Deteriorates quickly (~4% per hour of use); last approximately 24 hours before it is ruined
    
  • Not Repairable

[Jebcool]

Correction: we actually carry about 66 lbs in the games. 30kg = about 66lbs. Im still thinking from a survival perspective though. Seems something one would think to do is build a sled

[whisperwind777]

Pretty sure you can carry more than 30kg and still be able to sprint if not more than 40kg. Why do you guys carry so many stuff? If you go out harvesting a deer, you shouldn't be carrying a rifle, a storm lantern, a bedroll or a prybar. Leave them behind. Leave the food, water and fuel behind. It won't take you more than 3 hours to harvest a deer, so you can always make it back home if you start early. When it's already dusk, you shouldn't go out harvesting. When the carcass is too far away, it's better to harvest what you need and leave the rest, because you can always find more food and pelts. When you move, leave the fuel, water and pelts behind, they won't spoil. You can always pick up enough sticks to boil more water. And it is really sweet to find water and fuel left there if you are trapped by blizzard in a cabin you've been before. Why don't you make more places like home? If there's no one else in this frozen hell, who's gonna steal your stuff?

[PanzerRabbit]

One suggestion I saw.. somewhere, might've been steam forums at one point, that really made sense to me was to have clothing weigh more in the pack but less when worn. Or rather, it affects your carry weight differently based on the utilization. Pants are just dead weight, rolled up in your pack, it's going to be more of a burden than it would be distributed more evenly across your lower body.

This! It makes so much sense.

[Jebcool]

I'm going to move this topic to the alpha wishlist section. Titled: Sled.

Feel free to take your comments there guys