Rope climbing weight restrictions

[piddy3825]

6 hours ago, Patrick Carlson said:

Folks, keep it friendly. Thank you.

All we've said about updates is that Faithful Cartographer was the final Sandbox update prior to our August launch - which is still the case. That's the focus of the team right now. If you want to see the most accurate context regarding our thinking on the game and continued development, I recommend you check out our official FAQ. http://www.thelongdark.com/news/frequently-asked-questions/

 

Hello @Patrick Carlson,

thanks for the link to the FAQ's, and my most humble apologies if anyone found anything offensive or unfriendly in this thread.  Honestly, as originator of this thread, I have read all the posts and can't really find anything that could be considered unfriendly.  I new when I originally posted that there wasn't gonna be any dev commentary, feedback or response.  I knew that  because I saw Raphael's video when Faithful Cartographer released.  That being said, I figured at least  you guys might read the thread and who knows if our comments would have any merit that might change things when story mode finally launches.  I have always appreciated the opportunity that Hinterland has afforded it's player customers in providing direct feedback and a venue in which to share opinions, strategies, stories and suggestions.

Again, my most humble apologies if anyone was offended by any comments in this discussion thread.

[Patrick Carlson]

12 hours ago, piddy3825 said:

Hello @Patrick Carlson,

thanks for the link to the FAQ's, and my most humble apologies if anyone found anything offensive or unfriendly in this thread.  Honestly, as originator of this thread, I have read all the posts and can't really find anything that could be considered unfriendly.  I new when I originally posted that there wasn't gonna be any dev commentary, feedback or response.  I knew that  because I saw Raphael's video when Faithful Cartographer released.  That being said, I figured at least  you guys might read the thread and who knows if our comments would have any merit that might change things when story mode finally launches.  I have always appreciated the opportunity that Hinterland has afforded it's player customers in providing direct feedback and a venue in which to share opinions, strategies, stories and suggestions.

Again, my most humble apologies if anyone was offended by any comments in this discussion thread.

There was some name-calling, but it was deleted. Carry on! The change to rope climbing is recent, so we appreciate you letting us know how it's working out for you (or not). While we're focused right now on launching Wintermute, we're always taking into account the experience of the game more generally. Thanks again. 

[SteveP]

I'm perfectly ok with weight restrictions on the rope being abrupt maximums and I like that as you ascend or descend, you loose strength and can slip.

I don't like that you can scuttle down the side of the cliffs so easily. I don't know the steepness but any time one is scrambling on cliff faces without ropes is, in real life, extremely hazardous. I think there should be a percentage chance of loosing your footing while climbing down especially if the gradient is so steep you cannot ascend it. Make cliff scrambling more dangerous and then it won't seem like a game exploit. We don't really have anything like sliding in TLD; you are either falling or moving very slowly sideways.

What we may be seeing is a constraint on the way the maps and the character interact so I'm all in favour of better physics but not if it is going to take months of work to implement.

I don't mind at all that there are several navigable paths down the mountain. In fact, there are also navigable paths leading up around many rope ascents! I always thought it was good that you had to be awake enough to discover these on your own! Don't take things for granted!

[Carbon]

7 minutes ago, SteveP said:

I always thought it was good that you had to be awake enough to discover these on your own! Don't take things for granted!

Taking something for granted and not seeing something have no correlation at all. But thanks for the tips.

[JoE Smash]

1 hour ago, SteveP said:

I'm perfectly ok with weight restrictions on the rope being abrupt maximums and I like that as you ascend or descend, you loose strength and can slip.

I don't like that you can scuttle down the side of the cliffs so easily. I don't know the steepness but any time one is scrambling on cliff faces without ropes is, in real life, extremely hazardous. I think there should be a percentage chance of loosing your footing while climbing down especially if the gradient is so steep you cannot ascend it. Make cliff scrambling more dangerous and then it won't seem like a game exploit. We don't really have anything like sliding in TLD; you are either falling or moving very slowly sideways.

What we may be seeing is a constraint on the way the maps and the character interact so I'm all in favour of better physics but not if it is going to take months of work to implement.

I don't mind at all that there are several navigable paths down the mountain. In fact, there are also navigable paths leading up around many rope ascents! I always thought it was good that you had to be awake enough to discover these on your own! Don't take things for granted!

Yes please make looting TWM more impossible than it currently is! Do what Steve said please!

[SteveP]

By taking for granted, I mean the status quo. Don't take the status quo for granted.

[RossBondReturns]

Seriously I just raided TWM in my current series and have pretty much always gone down the face of the mountain so I see absolutely no issues with this.

Now did I bring everything off the mountain with me nope, but I was well overweight coming down.

To get up is extremely simple too. Fast and light. Coffee and tea. Bedroll. Lantern/Flares.

Boom...done.

I might even turn right around and do it again to get more stuff down. (Since I still have enough coffee and teas to do it).

I really don't get the big deal...that's my 2 cents.

[Thrasador]

You should be able to slide down a rope with more weight than climbing up. I agree with the OP....makes sense. Or what about just tying your pack to the rope and lowering it, and then climb down after it much lighter than having it on your back?

[piddy3825]

11 hours ago, RossBondReturns said:

Seriously I just raided TWM in my current series and have pretty much always gone down the face of the mountain so I see absolutely no issues with this.

Now did I bring everything off the mountain with me nope, but I was well overweight coming down.

To get up is extremely simple too. Fast and light. Coffee and tea. Bedroll. Lantern/Flares.

Boom...done.

I might even turn right around and do it again to get more stuff down. (Since I still have enough coffee and teas to do it).

I really don't get the big deal...that's my 2 cents.

 

8 hours ago, Thrasador said:

You should be able to slide down a rope with more weight than climbing up. I agree with the OP....makes sense. Or what about just tying your pack to the rope and lowering it, and then climb down after it much lighter than having it on your back?

given the steep incline, in previous play through's, I had never attempted to descend the summit via the cliff face.  But having just recently competed looting the summit and descending via various routes down the cliff face over encumbered and taking minimal damage in the process, I'd have to agree with you now that this mechanic is firmly in place.  At any rate, I still think you should be able to descend with more weight that climbing up.  Or as Thrasador mentioned, lowering the pack via a rope.  make the pack the same 30k limit and you would have to carry an extra 5k rope to do so.  

 

[JAFO]

On 7/13/2017 at 4:45 PM, Thrasador said:

Or what about just tying your pack to the rope and lowering it, and then climb down after it much lighter than having it on your back?

I wish I had a dollar for every time I've seen this suggestion on the forums.. 

[Thrasador]

32 minutes ago, JAFO said:

I wish I had a dollar for every time I've seen this suggestion on the forums.. 

Maybe it should be implemented then? That would be swellzies! 

[Timber Wolf]

1 hour ago, Thrasador said:

Maybe it should be implemented then? That would be swellzies! 

There are atleast two routes down the mountain that don't require using a rope. 

I like the weight restriction, just as I like not having a sled (or equivalent) in the game.  I don't think it should be easy or convenient to move lots of stuff.  

Instead, they should try to find a way to prevent players like me from skating down the side of a mountain in just a couple hours while being heavily encumbered. 

[Thrasador]

19 minutes ago, Timber Wolf said:

There are atleast two routes down the mountain that don't require using a rope. 

I like the weight restriction, just as I like not having a sled (or equivalent) in the game.  I don't think it should be easy or convenient to move lots of stuff.  

Instead, they should try to find a way to prevent players like me from skating down the side of a mountain in just a couple hours while being heavily encumbered. 

Wow so you want things to be even worse?! I definitely don't agree. Part of survival in this game is moving to greener pastures, to find fresh survival supplies. I would like a way to do this more easily, that doesn't involve abandoning useful items or making six trips between zones.

I hope we can craft saddle bags for the horsie we may be getting. That would help...

I wouldn't even ride the horse, he'd be a pack horse. Maybe the horse can drag an improvised sled....

[Timber Wolf]

4 minutes ago, Thrasador said:

Part of survival in this game is moving to greener pastures, to find fresh survival supplies. I would like a way to do this more easily,

Why should this be easier?  It only took me 30 days to move a ridiculous amount of stuff to the Mountaineer's Hut.

[Thrasador]

2 minutes ago, Timber Wolf said:

Why should this be easier?  It only took me 30 days to move a ridiculous amount of stuff to the Mountaineer's Hut.

Rofl! That sounds splendid!

[fearofspam]

On 7/5/2017 at 7:34 PM, piddy3825 said:

I have a lot of hours in the sandbox, and spend the majority of my time on TWM, but it wasn't until this most recent play through that I discovered those various routes that you mention coming down from the summit.  Yes, fairly easy to just walk down, but steep enough not to be able to walk back up in most spots.  I still think that the main reason was to merely add play time when story mode releases, otherwise the first chapter in the story we have all been waiting for plays itself out in less than 6 hours.

I doubt very seriously the game will be 6 hours long.  I'm picturing only a couple of hours for each episode.  And even if they were trying to extend play time, this is the most idiotic way of doing it.  It would be like making it take a full minute to open each can of food.  They've already added seconds on to every time you search something or harvest something.  It takes almost as long to check the visor in a car as it does to check a cabinet in a kitchen.  The only thing this does is make it more frustrating to play.  

Turning a 90-minute movie into a 3 hour movie by having everyone move in slow motion doesn't make it more enjoyable.  Just silly.

Also, not everyone knows about this leisurely stroll down from the summit.  I've never found any clear instructions or seen a video of it so the entire TWM has been pointless to try and play since FC.  I know I'm not the only one who no longer plays TWM because of it.  It completely ruins the satisfaction of reaching the summit if I can't loot it in a reasonable amount of time.

[JAFO]

15 minutes ago, fearofspam said:

I doubt very seriously the game will be 6 hours long.  I'm picturing only a couple of hours for each episode.

Well, what they've said about it in the recently published FAQ was:

Quote

Since THE LONG DARK is not a purely linear game like most of the other episodic games available to date, play time can vary from player to player. However, in our playtests, we have found episode play times typically range from 4-6 hours. This will generally be our target for episode play lengths moving forward as well, as we think it allows a good amount of time to develop an interesting story while letting players experience the open-world survival gameplay The Long Dark is known for.

So, since two episodes are being released to begin with, that's a "typical" playthrough time of 8-12 hours.

How typical playthrough times turn out to be in the real world, remains to be seen.. but I'm hopeful.

[fearofspam]

4 minutes ago, JAFO said:

.. but I'm hopeful.

It's good to be hopeful.  Over the years I've just become so jaded with this game...  

My only other experience with an early release game was so good that it makes the TLD development team look really really bad by comparison.  Different developers, different strokes I guess.  I have no idea what is standard when it comes to these things.

Have you heard that TLD will allow modding?  Someone mentioned a rumor.  That could solve some play-ability issues down the line. *dreams of the ability to throw things off a cliff so I can climb down with ease*

[JAFO]

5 minutes ago, fearofspam said:

Have you heard that TLD will allow modding?  Someone mentioned a rumor.

It's more than a rumour. Raphael has publicly stated that he is in favour of modding (his own career as a developer grew out of his experience as a modder), and that he wants to open TLD to modding in future, but that for now, their priorities are to get the game released.

[JAFO]

12 minutes ago, fearofspam said:

My only other experience with an early release game was so good that it makes the TLD development team look really really bad by comparison.  Different developers, different strokes I guess.  I have no idea what is standard when it comes to these things.

There is no standard when it comes to early access games. It varies hugely. The Hinterland team are absolutely not so good at dealing with the process as some others, but it's largely explained by their backgrounds. Many (most?) early-access games tend to come from passionate amateurs with an idea. They are mad-keen gamers themselves, used to interacting with a community of like-minded players. They know just what they'd like to have seen done with their favourite games. The way they approach early-access is heavily influenced by all this.

The Hinterland team, however, whilst very likely being mad-keen gamers themselves, had, before becoming Indy developers, worked in the AAA gaming world, where the work process is very different. Publishing roadmaps, dealing directly with end-users, catering to the public rather than the publishers, all were things totally outside their experience, and to begin with, they were highly suspicious and wary of the entire process. They've lightened up considerably over the years, but are still far more reserved about it than most Indy developers. They're learning, and doing all right.. even if a healthy dose of "chillax and listen to your public more" wouldn't go astray.

[fearofspam]

Thank you Jafo, that is very good to know.  My only other experience is with subnautica and it is nothing like this.

[SnowWalker]

11 minutes ago, fearofspam said:

Thank you Jafo, that is very good to know.  My only other experience is with subnautica and it is nothing like this.

I knew you were talking about Subnautica. I hate that game. Hate it I tell you, lol. I got my money back the next day. I don't like fantasy and blatantly, carnoon-ish scapes when I'm playing survival. That's just me though. I don't mind it in adventure, like Abzu, or Submerged, but I like survival to have more realism.

[SnowWalker]

On 2017-07-14 at 11:09 PM, Thrasador said:

I hope we can craft saddle bags for the horsie we may be getting.

What....we're getting a horse?

[SnowWalker]

On 2017-07-14 at 8:20 PM, JAFO said:

I wish I had a dollar for every time I've seen this suggestion on the forums.. 

It's more than just a suggestion though, it's common sense. It's what I would do in a real life situation anyway.

[JAFO]

20 minutes ago, fearofspam said:

Thank you Jafo, that is very good to know.  My only other experience is with subnautica and it is nothing like this.

My only other experiences are with Oolite (14 years an Indy game, and still going strong!) and Kerbal Space Program. Dealing with the developers of both are far more pleasurable experiences than with Hinterland.

2 minutes ago, SnowWalker said:

It's more than just a suggestion though, it's common sense. It's what I would do in a real life situation anyway.

I fully agree.. heck, I was one of the people suggesting it. Just wanted to indicate to @Thrasador that they were far from the first person to come up with the idea, and that Hinterland were surely aware of it.