Snow Shelters


SteveP

Snow Shelter Purpose and Enhancements  

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I am curious about snow shelters; why aren't they used more often by players (or vice versa)?

Do  you use them often yourself?

What are the good points and bad points of snow shelters?

What should be changed about snow shelters?

Should we have more types of snow shelters such as simple trench style, quinzhee, snow tent, full on igloo?

Counter-point: are more types of snow shelters overkill and unnecessary and why?

What situations would you think a snow shelter would be handy for?

What do you think about how long it takes to build a quick snow shelter?

Would you be ok with expending more time to construct a nicer snow shelter that might be warmer for instance? Think about if you could construct your skookum shelter in stages.

Under what circumstances will a bear rip into a snow shelter? Has it happened to you? Do wolves get into your snow shelter too?

In the interests of saving space, I prefer not to see posts with extensive quotes; just quickly refer to the questions OR delete the quote before hitting Submit. Or just go free form with whatever strikes you as interesting. I've added a poll place holder that I will modify later (hopefully) with the most interesting questions and the range of proposals made.

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I seldom use the snow shelter, and I think it's mainly because I began playing this game long before they were introduced.  That means I already know my way to shelter from pretty much anywhere and it costs fewer resources to get somewhere than it does to build one.  Perhaps if I was a new player and didn't know where I was or how to get anywhere, I would be using it more.

These are the only situations that come to mind when I might possibly use a snow shelter:

  1.  I somehow get lost and have no idea where I am.
  2.  In interloper, I haven't found a bedroll and I desperately need to sleep, but I'm too far from a bed and can't easily get to one.
  3.  Building one near my base so I can get some "outside time" to avoid cabin fever.

I don't think more types of snow shelter would be useful, unless there was one that could be made in out on the open ice and/or on a slope.  Since we can't drag carcasses to a wind break and we can't build fires on slopes, I'd have a real use for being able to put up some kind of small shelter that would shield you (or your fire) from the wind and let you harvest while inside it.  That would be great.

I wish the snow shelter used only natural materials rather than cloth.  I'd prefer to have something in the game like pine branches that gets used for shelters and then be able to use cloth for a makeshift bedroll (separate from the shelter).  I'd be ok with the makeshift bedroll not giving any temperature bonus and with the snow shelter not letting you sleep without a bedroll.  Having the two things together would give the current functionality.  

Last, I see the real future potential of the snow shelter being for some future map with no other shelters to speak of.  Think Timberwolf Mountain but with no Mountaineer's Hut and even fewer caves, maybe very long distances that you need to travel and a snow shelter is the only way to hunker down in a storm.  Ideally, there'd be some unique resource there that would make it worth the trip.  That could be a lot of fun!

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if we could use things other than cloth they would be more useful like wolf hides, deer hides bear etc. pine bows would be nice too.  also some way to mark their location easier like manufacturing a flag (cloth) on a pole perhaps? if the player had a map of his own in his journal ( a crude thing he could be making along the way) then he could make it somehow. plus they deteriorate quickly.

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Much like @Best_Leopard , I use mine for alternating nights outside when bivouacked at a known location like the farmhouse in PV.  Just need to remember to daily check them for repairs.  As long as you do it daily or every other day, it will typically only need a stick or two.

I like to build mine under shelter, so for the Farmhouse, for example, I built mine in the open barn area.  As for locating the. From afar, they do have an anomalous terrain glitch that lets them be seen from about. 200 yards away.

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My partner was playing last night and used a snow shelter in a relevant and useful way, which I thought I'd share.  It's a relatively new Interloper game that started in PV.  She'd made her way through to Winding River and the Dam, but hasn't been able to find a bedroll yet.  By the time she arrived at the entrance to ML, she had 20% condition and was completely exhausted, with 8 hours of darkness left.  Getting to a shelter with a bed (even just up to the logging camp) would have been quite a risk.  Not even considering wolves, she would have been moving so slowly from exhaustion that freezing damage would have been quite dangerous.

What she did was build a large fire outside near a flat area and then build a snow shelter next to it.  She was then able to rest through the night while regaining some condition and set out for the logging camp when she was better prepared.  Worked out very well.

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2 hours ago, Best_Leopard said:

My partner was playing last night and used a snow shelter in a relevant and useful way, which I thought I'd share.  It's a relatively new Interloper game that started in PV.  She'd made her way through to Winding River and the Dam, but hasn't been able to find a bedroll yet.  By the time she arrived at the entrance to ML, she had 20% condition and was completely exhausted, with 8 hours of darkness left.  Getting to a shelter with a bed (even just up to the logging camp) would have been quite a risk.  Not even considering wolves, she would have been moving so slowly from exhaustion that freezing damage would have been quite dangerous.

What she did was build a large fire outside near a flat area and then build a snow shelter next to it.  She was then able to rest through the night while regaining some condition and set out for the logging camp when she was better prepared.  Worked out very well.

Thanks for sharing this account. It illustrates one of the situations where the Snow Shelter can make all the difference. Because there are currently so many permanent "shelter" options in the game (depending on the Region, of course), the Snow Shelter can be best thought of as a bridge between them. Or you can use it to establish a kind of outpost far from one of the permanent structures--in Timberwolf Mountain for instance. In my own games, I tend to take risks in bad weather, so the Snow Shelter comes in handy when a blizzard makes navigation unreliable. :crosseye:

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I've only ever made one snow shelter. I was playing interloper and I didn't have a bedroll. I wanted to shelter inside a cave, but couldn't sleep there, so I built the shelter just outside the opening.

After sleeping, I couldn't figure our how to exit the snow shelter and had to quit the game.

Haven't used one since.

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21 hours ago, Pillock said:

...After sleeping, I couldn't figure our how to exit the snow shelter and had to quit the game....

Hey @Pillock, when I used one for the first time, I was somewhat baffled as well, but in the process of trying to look into back the shelter (like looking at my feet) the menu item for exiting came up.  It is on the side of the wall...see pic...hope this helps!

Snow-Shelter-Exit.png

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Never tried them because everything is close enough. That situation with the damn is a good one. I'm thinking about my future interloper trips. Since a fire is required anyway I think that a cave+bedroll would still be the best option.

 

But I respect the addiction, other players may need them. I would probably try it in a beautiful spot. Just so that I can say "I have a shelter on the lake overlook!"

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Four members voted on the poll before I added the options. If you state what you voted for, perhaps we can discount those votes. I do not know if it is possible for you to change your votes now. Add your comments please, if you did. Also, please comment if this discussion has made you aware of potential uses for the snow shelter you were unaware of! It's nice to know if it has been helpful. Thank you for your participation and interest!

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  • 1 month later...

Never had much use for the snow shelter or so I thought.   Recently on Interloper I have had some issues not reaching a bed and having no bedroll.  The worst is having the fire blow out while using a car to sleep in.  The car before crumbling highway in CH or the truck by the mine and in both places the fire got snuffed and so my character died freezing in their sleep.  Dealing with exhaustion, suffering too much condition loss then encounter a wolf and then I am dead. 

Been experimenting with the shelter and I am starting to have a better appreciation that the shelter is part of the game. 

The improvement to a shelter could be adding rabbit pelts to boost warmth bonus.  Other than mittens and improving harvesting skill there is no use for them and the pelts are piling up around camp.

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  • 4 weeks later...

Howdy @SteveP!  Yes I do use the snow shelter. Fact I use it quite religiously. I find it to be a very helpful tool for not only increasing my time outside, but also to ensure I never get cabin fever. Whatever area I happen to be in at the time,  once I reach whatever location I'm going to use as my base of operations, I will set up a snow shelter in a nearby location so that I can alternate between inside and outside sleeping during the night.

Its important, obviously, to keep the snow shelter maintained.  That way it doesn't decay and also I find it prudent to dismantle it before doing any long excursions which are going to take multiple days.   It's always quite disconcerting to come back from a long trip and find that your snow shelter has degraded to the point where it can't be fixed and can't be removed. Something that I believe should be corrected. 

My 2¢

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Been using snow shelters and found that placing them in a sweet spot is difficult.  Looking for wind protection for the fire and a location for the shelter is tricky.  Usually a fire is built then the snow shelter.  Once the fire is up then it seems the snow shelter cannot be built near the fire.  So I am left planning the placements of the snow shelter and fire.   There needs to be more planning available

Currently the snow shelter placement only shows up if you have the necessary materials (5 cloth 15 sticks) and are in the correct position.  Finding a valid place for the snow shelter is hard and It seems there are more invalid places than valid ones.  Sometimes the valid location are in unusual places and not predictable.  My proposal is when the snow shelter is selected to be constructed have an outline of valid locations appear in a short radius around the player.  If the materials are not available the valid locations (hotspots) should still be visible (think planning).  This way a fire can be placed near the valid area for the shelter.

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The Good

  • I was quite surprised by how warm it kept you
  • Being able to use a campfire directly outside of it without having to step out
  • Being able to generally eat / drink / sleep (rave, repeat) as needed to help mitigate possibly some afflictions.
  • Also felt pretty cool carving something and impacting the physicality of the area around you beyond just dropping / moving items and killing creatures.

The Bad

  • Saddened by how it didn't provide protection for the campfire
  • How limited the resources needed in construction are (twigs and cloth, forced with no alternatives)
  • That it can only be placed on deep snowy sections with no alternatives to ice, or rocky but well sheltered areas (sometimes sinks under the snow over what might be a prop that extends the snowy ground, but doesn't register properly for the snow shelter)
  • Doesn't seem to require tools (I'd expect us to use at least a shovel, doing it all by hand is... messed up and would take both a long time, and also possibly cause frostbite unless our hands are well protected)

The Ugly (aka My hopes and wishes)

  • Be allowed to use a sleeping bag inside the shelter, further boosting rest temperatures, pretty common sense, if you have it and you don't use it in the middle of a blizzard waiting for it to pass it's rather nonsensical.
  • Possible to create a variety of shelters, usually by steadily improving one after the other, pouring more resources such as time, hides, cloth, and thick wood, allowing more benefits of warmth and storage of raw meat and fresh hides/guts for curing, while becoming more spacious and significantly more reliable in a blizzard.
  • Chance of collapse from blizzard.  Each hour a check is made of the shelter against its chances of structural damage.  If this check succeeds either minor damage occurs - character sleep is interrupted and informed, possible to repair whatever was damaged using sticks, or major damage, where the shelter collapses.  The player must wriggle out of the wreckage, hides and cloth will be partially recoverable, sticks would not, and consider starting fresh.  A well enough souped up shelter, as long as its maintained with occasional repairs will be impervious to a blizzard for over 6 hours before additional maintenance is required.
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Hey @luponius, Clint Eastwood would be so proud of that post...

I completely agree with your "The Good" list!  It truly is a great tool for us to use.  Now on your, "The Bad" list...

58 minutes ago, luponius said:

The Bad

  • Saddened by how it didn't provide protection for the campfire
  • How limited the resources needed in construction are (twigs and cloth, forced with no alternatives)
  • That it can only be placed on deep snowy sections with no alternatives to ice, or rocky but well sheltered areas (sometimes sinks under the snow over what might be a prop that extends the snowy ground, but doesn't register properly for the snow shelter)
  • Doesn't seem to require tools (I'd expect us to use at least a shovel, doing it all by hand is... messed up and would take both a long time, and also possibly cause frostbite unless our hands are well protected)

 

...I would merely point out that a campfire IN a snow shelter would equal a short freezing bath. :)  The heat would compromise the shelter, wouldn't it?  On your second point, I concur with you.  Perhaps allowing for the use of rabbit pelts or some other "relatively" easy to obtain material would be a good idea?  As for your third point, I have been able to build them under the shed at the family home in PV, so it can be done, but you are correct that there are a lot of restrictions.  I do wonder if providing a mechanic to allow for the reinforcement of the structures using hides would be a thought for making a more long term outdoors shelter?  As for the tools, I follow your logic, but seems like there might be an implied use of sticks with cloth webbed into a makeshift hand shovel?  Or maybe I am over thinking it.

Quote

 

The Ugly (aka My hopes and wishes)

  • Be allowed to use a sleeping bag inside the shelter, further boosting rest temperatures, pretty common sense, if you have it and you don't use it in the middle of a blizzard waiting for it to pass it's rather nonsensical.
  • Possible to create a variety of shelters, usually by steadily improving one after the other, pouring more resources such as time, hides, cloth, and thick wood, allowing more benefits of warmth and storage of raw meat and fresh hides/guts for curing, while becoming more spacious and significantly more reliable in a blizzard.
  • Chance of collapse from blizzard.  Each hour a check is made of the shelter against its chances of structural damage.  If this check succeeds either minor damage occurs - character sleep is interrupted and informed, possible to repair whatever was damaged using sticks, or major damage, where the shelter collapses.  The player must wriggle out of the wreckage, hides and cloth will be partially recoverable, sticks would not, and consider starting fresh.  A well enough souped up shelter, as long as its maintained with occasional repairs will be impervious to a blizzard for over 6 hours before additional maintenance is required.


 

As for your, "The Ugly" points, I think they are beautiful!  My experience is this, if you do not repair your Snow Shelter on at least a 2-3 day basis, it is going to collapse soon.

All in all, great post IMHO.

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3 hours ago, luponius said:
  • Be allowed to use a sleeping bag inside the shelter, further boosting rest temperatures, pretty common sense, if you have it and you don't use it in the middle of a blizzard waiting for it to pass it's rather nonsensical.

This already works.  If you are carrying a blue bedroll you get your bag's temp bonus.  Otherwise the blue bedroll gives a set +3C.  If you are carrying a bear bedroll, there's a new icon for that in the radial menu, and sleeping with that gives your bear bedroll's temp bonus.

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18 hours ago, L² said:

Hey @luponius, Clint Eastwood would be so proud of that post...

I completely agree with your "The Good" list!  It truly is a great tool for us to use.  Now on your, "The Bad" list......I would merely point out that a campfire IN a snow shelter would equal a short freezing bath. :)  The heat would compromise the shelter, wouldn't it? 

Mr. Eastwood nods and spits tobacco in my direction with respect! :P

As for the campfire I mentioned protection for it when building a snow shelter, not to place it inside the shelter.

It could totally be an independent thing from snow shelter.  So you either make a campfire (usual one) or a firepit, which requires say 5 stones and 5 twigs to make a wind-resistant fire pit.  Blizzards will still take it out, but strong winds will protect it from burning out too quick.

18 hours ago, L² said:

I do wonder if providing a mechanic to allow for the reinforcement of the structures using hides would be a thought for making a more long term outdoors shelter?

As for this I would say that this could possibly be further extended to typical buildings, which over time might have blizzard blast through the windows, and crack through the wooden construction, requiring maintenance to maintain insulation.  Might be a neat additional layer of consideration if someone wants to settle in a warm home.

16 hours ago, Ruruwawa said:

This already works.  If you are carrying a blue bedroll you get your bag's temp bonus.  Otherwise the blue bedroll gives a set +3C.  If you are carrying a bear bedroll, there's a new icon for that in the radial menu, and sleeping with that gives your bear bedroll's temp bonus.

Ah, good to know, would appreciate some visual feedback for it then for the slow fools like me! :D 

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I only built a shelter once when Interloper was in test branch and i did everything to be as save as possible. I was travelling from CH to ML to look for the bedroll - so i made a shelter in the ravine. That was the only time.

Maybe people think it is or was useful to built one in specific situations but from my point of view they are completly useless. The maps are just way to small and have too many beds. You can ALWAYS reach the next shelter faster than building a shelter. On top you need a camp fire (materials for both + more weight), are not protected against wolves, and need a good spot. Even if you could build a shelter as fast as travelling to the next bed, all these additional things still would make it a bad move.

I prefer using the time to go to the next bed-house. There i don't have to make a fire, are save from wildlife, just sleep 1h to warm up, can save matches, can use a fire to make water/food and not wasting burning time to warm up, not beeing encumbered with building materials for a shelter (or even worse start collecting sticks in a storm while freezing) and so on.

Yes, if you feel that a shelter at some point was a good idea, than the game did what it's supposed to do - it entertained you. But no, in fact, building a shelter is never a good idea because there is always a better option.

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I respectfully disagree. However, everyone is entitled to their own opinion, so thanks for sharing yours.

Just to be clear, I never start a fire when I use my shelter. I simply build my shelter and get into it, sleeping in 2 hour increments. True, the time spent to build one might also be used to head to a known structure, however I personally think I would be over generalizing things to say that I could 'always' make it to a structure in the time it takes to make a snow shelter. Circumstances can be such that making a snow shelter in a wind blocked area would be more heat efficient than fighting against the wind in a blizzard.  Additionally, making the shelter also thereby means not only not taking the temperature hit of fighting through the storm, but also not taking the clothing deterioration hit as well.

These are just my opinions and thoughts...my 2¢ so to speak.

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14 hours ago, MueckE said:

But no, in fact, building a shelter is never a good idea because there is always a better option.

This seems a bit too dogmatic.  Depends on your play style and the specific challenge you face.  For example, I like to go straight to the summit on interloper if I spawn on TWM, provided I can find a piece of bonus clothing so I can tear it all up for 5 pieces of cloth.  Without coffee, you have to use a snow shelter to regain enough rest for the last rope.  

Yes, I could take days longer to go to another zone to find a sleeping bag, or scour TWM for a hacksaw and open crates in case I'm lucky enough to find coffee -- but that's not my play style.  I find the day 1 push for the summit much more rewarding -- and fun.

I can think of other situations where trading 3 cloth for a snow shelter (I get 2 back from salvaging the shelter) lets me take risks that made my adventure more interesting.  Do I build snow shelters constantly?  Of course not.  But this is a game of risk/reward; sometimes it's worth it.

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The number one reason I don't build snow shelters: cloth. I generally don't have much in way of spare cloth, and generally if I am roaming around and need shelter, I don't have any spare blankets to tear up. I'm not even sure why cloth is a requirement of a snow shelter. A typical leaf hut or lean to is made from sticks, a long log for the backbone, and deadfall, leaves, or pine boughs. Can we make pine boughs a thing in game and take cloth out of the recipe?

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