Weapon Accoutrements

[ThePantsMann]

To be specific. Like a rifle scope. A strap. I'm not saying anything fancy, but basic tools to aid on the slaughter and gathering of food

[EternityTide]

Join the club. I've been requesting a scope for over a year now.

[ThePantsMann]

Damn. Over a year. Let's get a petition going or something.

[SteveP]

+1 scope with graduated reticle and markings to assist in estimating range.

A range estimating reticle assist looks a little bit like this:

only smaller. You line up the deer in your image and when it fits the width of the red line, you read off the range.

Here's another with both cross hairs and ranging estimator:

And here is a nice reticle with the range graduations built in for a specific cartridge load and bullet.

This style of scope is nice to work with and expensive too. Mostly a shooter has to adjust the scope by clicks for each 1/4 MOA. Unfortunately, such spiffy enhancements belong in a real hunting simulator, not in a general audience survival game. It would be nice to be able to adjust the rifle sights for range. This was possible on the British .303 Enfield with metal open peep sights.

[EternityTide]

See one of my earlier posts: viewtopic.php?f=59&t=3345&p=22908&hilit=+scope#p22908

[ThePantsMann]

+1 scope with graduated reticle and markings to assist in estimating range.

A range estimating reticle assist looks a little bit like this:

only smaller. You line up the deer in your image and when it fits the width of the red line, you read off the range.

Here's another with both cross hairs and ranging estimator:

And here is a nice reticle with the range graduations built in for a specific cartridge load and bullet.

This style of scope is nice to work with and expensive too. Mostly a shooter has to adjust the scope by clicks for each 1/4 MOA. Unfortunately, such spiffy enhancements belong in a real hunting simulator, not in a general audience survival game. It would be nice to be able to adjust the rifle sights for range. This was possible on the British .303 Enfield with metal open peep sights.

This is beautiful! Say.... Do we know If we have actual bullet drop in the game as of right now? Do or physics go that far?

[selfless]

No bullet physics at all. If it is the first surface in the line of the sight when you pull the trigger, it gets hit, instantly. There's a maximum range cut off as well, and it is actually very short (~50 meters). Bow has longer range...

[ThePantsMann]

No bullet physics at all. If it is the first surface in the line of the sight when you pull the trigger, it gets hit, instantly. There's a maximum range cut off as well, and it is actually very short (~50 meters). Bow has longer range...

Good to know. Makes sense why I couldn't shoot a bear that was a million miles away (distance was estimated, not measured) with the bow, as I am not yet familiarized with the drop in the arrow minus distance to said target. What can I expect when trying to a target bull's-eye from, say, 50m? Is there a formula?

[selfless]

Umm, probably? To shoot arrows a bit further aim a bit higher. No drag. No wind. Physics are bare bones, get-the-arrow-to-arc-in-flight type.

Point was, arrows have some physics, bullets do not. In fact, bullets do not exist at all. Their effect is all that exists. And what gets affected is determined by projecting a ray, straight line, out of the sight, to the first surface it encounters. As long as that surface is within the first 50 meters. Everything past that is not even calculated, I'll bet.

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To comment on the thread's original premise, I guess I don't think enhancement is necessary. It would be nice if the range of the rifle was not capped. And a telescopic sight or separate binocular effect would be awesome. But I don't think searching for the ultimate weapon need be added to gameplay. Keeping tools basic is good, concentrate gameplay on proper and economic use of tools not on luck of finding the better ones. Put the scope on every rifle if it is ever added to the game. Keep it simple.

[SteveP]

Do we know If we have actual bullet drop in the game as of right now? Do or physics go that far?

I suspect that there is bullet drop with increasing range. Somebody did some experiments aiming at the side of the Coastal Hwy Quonset service station but no one has done anything definitive. I only shoot from close range since I hate wasting bullets.

[Barretts Privateer]

To be honest, I am much the same. I'd advise you to save your ammunition for close range encounters, if you've got a steady hand. Wait until the wolf is very close (I've actually had the fight sequence start, just before I fired) before firing, to ensure maximum chances. When they're close to you, the wolves run in straight lines.

If you have flares, USE THEM! Don't waste your ammunition! Flares are much more common than rifle ammunition, and with the addition of the flare gun recently, you have more range than your arm does. A well-placed throw/shot will scare even a bear away. Again, wait for the wolf to stop (they usually will if you have a lit flare) and then throw it right in front of it. Bears, throw it, hope it runs off. If not, you'd better bail out.

Otherwise, for food, just take what you can from snares, plants, scavenging, and carcasses. (Though, if you have a chance to shoot a bear in the head (i.e, the one outside the Pleasant Valley farmhouse), do it. I managed to take one down with two shots to the head. The amount of meat I earned was definitely worth it.

[madrepityu]

But why do you all need a scope when the rifle's range are so short?!

You can clearly see your target while you are out of the range of the rifle.

[madrepityu]

To be honest, I am much the same. I'd advise you to save your ammunition for close range encounters, if you've got a steady hand. Wait until the wolf is very close (I've actually had the fight sequence start, just before I fired) before firing, to ensure maximum chances. When they're close to you, the wolves run in straight lines.

If you have flares, USE THEM! Don't waste your ammunition! Flares are much more common than rifle ammunition, and with the addition of the flare gun recently, you have more range than your arm does. A well-placed throw/shot will scare even a bear away. Again, wait for the wolf to stop (they usually will if you have a lit flare) and then throw it right in front of it. Bears, throw it, hope it runs off. If not, you'd better bail out.

Otherwise, for food, just take what you can from snares, plants, scavenging, and carcasses. (Though, if you have a chance to shoot a bear in the head (i.e, the one outside the Pleasant Valley farmhouse), do it. I managed to take one down with two shots to the head. The amount of meat I earned was definitely worth it.

Until the wolves doesn't take notice of your presence you can scare them away if you shoot an arrow somewhere near to them. You can do that from pretty far distance since you don't have to hit your target. There are plenty of resources to build bow and arrows, so I think it's a good practice to avoid wolf encounters.

[Dirmagnos]

Why would i wannt to scare wolf away with an arrow(or rifle) ?

Shooting arrow decreases its durability, at the same time well-placed arrow can kill charging wolf in 1 shot. So at least i get something in return for decreased arrow durability.

I find that in most cases i can actually outrun wolf, i just need to break line of sight and run as fast as i can. In 3 out of 4 cases wolf tend to lose me fairly easy.

Bear hunting is fairly easy as well. Even tho i almost never use it, since i hate to leave meat behind and i generally have more than i can eat(since it spoils fairly fast) at any given time. But normally i just find fallen tree or a high rock, climb on it, take a potshot and then hide and wait till it bleads 2 dead. Sometimes second shot is required, but if youre sitting on a fallen tree youre safe and can aim as much as you wannt.

[madrepityu]

Why would i wannt to scare wolf away with an arrow(or rifle) ?

Shooting arrow decreases its durability, at the same time well-placed arrow can kill charging wolf in 1 shot. So at least i get something in return for decreased arrow durability.

I find that in most cases i can actually outrun wolf, i just need to break line of sight and run as fast as i can. In 3 out of 4 cases wolf tend to lose me fairly easy.

Bear hunting is fairly easy as well. Even tho i almost never use it, since i hate to leave meat behind and i generally have more than i can eat(since it spoils fairly fast) at any given time. But normally i just find fallen tree or a high rock, climb on it, take a potshot and then hide and wait till it bleads 2 dead. Sometimes second shot is required, but if youre sitting on a fallen tree youre safe and can aim as much as you wannt.

1.) I just wrote that here, because someone might not know that. Like you, I bet. But perhaps someone else will find it usefull!

2.) Let's say you're fatiged, your conditions are low, don't have any decoy and you can't afford to be mauled. And there's that wolf between you and your shelter. You're right about the well placed shot, but it doesn't always work. It's a bit of a gamble. And there's situations when you can't afford gambling.

In my current stalker run I had found 4 birch saplings and 10 maple sapling just on ML. It's just one map!

4 birch saplings: That's 4 bow. Each shot takes 2% condition = 200 shots

10 maple sapling: That's 30 arrow, I can use at least 5 times each = 150 shots

I'm at day 171 and I still use my first bow, currently at 86% condition. That means I used it 7 times. So, as you may see, I'm not that desperate about running out of bow and arrows! And there's still three boxes of untouched ammo in the prepper cache with two rifles, and I'm carrying a rifle loaded with 9 rounds. There's another rifle in the Dam. And again, it's just on ML.

There are plenty of resources in TLD, so I'm not worried about what worries you.

[Dirmagnos]

Considering how much stuff you have how to hell do you mange to get to condition as low that it would require taking suppression fire... that may not work as well btw.

Once i get something to shoot from i have to do something extremely stupid to get even below 50% condition, that is generally enough to fight off at least 2 wolves in cqc.

[druffzilla]

No bullet physics at all. If it is the first surface in the line of the sight when you pull the trigger, it gets hit, instantly. There's a maximum range cut off as well, and it is actually very short (~50 meters). Bow has longer range...

Is this still the case with the newest version of the game?

I couldn't play much the past few weeks and therefor never tested it, but some changes where made to the rifle, more than the new sights I think.

[SteveP]

Is this still the case with the newest version of the game?

I couldn't play much the past few weeks and therefor never tested it, but some changes where made to the rifle, more than the new sights I think.

With distance you can still shoot an animal like a bear however a) you might not be perfectly aligned especially if fatigued b) in the game, the chances of a quick kill go down dramatically. It seems to be that you must be very close; about as close as if you drop your torch and bring up your weapon, the bear or wolf will stop at the perfect range. You can even work yourself a little bit closer to the bear to assure the one shot kill.

If you don't have time to harvest or are short on ammo, just use the torch to maneuver away from the animal and circle it. I demo on day 25 of my play through; see the comments for the exact video times. I won't shoot a wolf unless I intend to harvest it; bullets are too precious and I like to save them for bears.

See links below in my signature. Caveat: Voyageur Level. Stalker wolves may be more unpredictable!

[druffzilla]

Thanks SteveP, but I know how to shoot animals in TLD. Was my question not clear? I wanted to know if the bullet still magically cuts off at about 50 steps. I know it did in previous versions of the game, but there was quite some complaining about that so I thought they might have changed it.

[RenegadeReturn]

I don't think hunting is real problem in the game. As you movve crouched you have a large enough margin to scare or attract attention of wildlife on the last updates now. Just stay quiet. But adding a scope can be nice for Voyageur experience maybe...

[SteveP]

Was my question not clear? I wanted to know if the bullet still magically cuts off at about 50 steps.

No, I don't think it ever did that. My answer was Yes. You can shoot distances.

It is extremely difficult to measure ranges accurately or conduct experiments. Perhaps someone with internal knowledge of the game could answer this question more easily. I have no plans to conduct an experiment however we could start a new Game Challenge to see who can shoot the furthest. Distance to be measured by F8 screen shot of firing and F8 shot of harvesting. C² = A² + B² where A and B are the differences in X-Y coordinates and C is the range. To make it interesting, you could add the additional factor of difference in elevation too.

[madrepityu]

No, I don't think it ever did that. My answer was Yes. You can shoot distances.

I think you're wrong about that and druffzilla are right!

That's why I don't understand why would anyone need a scope?

[ThePantsMann]

No, I don't think it ever did that. My answer was Yes. You can shoot distances.

I think you're wrong about that and druffzilla are right!

That's why I don't understand why would anyone need a scope?

"Is", not are. And because scopes would help accuracy, not necessarily in distance. Bullet conservation would be nice. Not missing isn't always the option. I mean, we're not quick scoping. And bullets disappear after 50m apparently.

[madrepityu]

No, I don't think it ever did that. My answer was Yes. You can shoot distances.

I think you're wrong about that and druffzilla are right!

That's why I don't understand why would anyone need a scope?

"Is", not are. And because scopes would help accuracy, not necessarily in distance. Bullet conservation would be nice. Not missing isn't always the option. I mean, we're not quick scoping. And bullets disappear after 50m apparently.

I'm curious, why do you need more accuracy if you only can hit your target from a relatively close distance where you see them flawlessly? Do you realized that wolves and deers can approach you like 10 meters before they even notice you? Do you miss your target from like 10 meters? Or you want to shoot them from the other side of the map?

Bullet conservation?! Do you need more than one bullet to kill an animal right now, without the scope, or what? Well then, conserve your bullets by not using the rifle. So easy, so simple! You could easily survive hundreds of days without the rifle. Not to mention that you got like 150-200 arrow shots/map.

[akodo1]

+1 scope with graduated reticle and markings to assist in estimating range.

This was possible on the British .303 Enfield with metal open peep sights.

Okay, that is an aftermarket micrometer sight designed to be fired from a bench or on a shooting mat with a shooting jacket, sling, and glove for long range slow fire target shooting competition. It wasn't on military rifles and it wouldn't be used by hunters.

The Lee Enfield has a peep sight as is currently depicted in game that was to be used for ranges up to 300 yards, and beyond that you flipped up the sight to find a smaller peep that could be elevated for longer range shots. Note that these longer shots were more about throwing lead at a group of enemy troops, not precision aiming at individual enemy soldiers.

Scope in The Long Dark?

No!

At least not on the Lee Enfield.

As a hunting arm the Lee Enfield was/is popular in Canada because surplus military arms were sold to average folks when the Canadian Military upgraded it's rifles. These were worn rifles, inexpensive, and rugged. They were plenty accurate for regular hunting, but they don't really match the kind of hunting gun that one would expect to find a scope on.

Second, what would you do if you found a scope? Does the character have a workshop to drill-and-tap the barrel to accept a base mount? With screws properly sized to not be a barrel obstruction? Does the character have the tools to do this precisely enough as to not cause accuracy issues due to a less than true mount? Does the character find bases and rings too?

So once the character has drilled holes in the top of his rifle, screwed in the bases, mounted the rings, mounted the scope in the rings, sealed it all with blue locktite, how much ammo does he have to zero the scope to his rifle? You don't just slap a scope on and have the crosshairs magically align with where the point of impact is.

Does he have a bore-sight so he can instantly get 'on paper' and then use 5 or so more rounds to get on the bullseye? Or does he need 20 rounds because he may need 15 to find the paper?

Should a different rifle that has a scope on it be included? Maybe. But find a scope and slap it on a rifle and expect it to be anything other than a disaster? No.