ThatDearGuy

Frequent game freezes (crash log included)

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I'm running TLD in DX11 and I see frequent to infrequent freezes. Save one recent instance where I put an oil lamp on top of a box next to the furnace in the Riken, they all appear to be happening at random, but I wonder if they are more frequent in very high FPS areas. No real proof there, but a number of them happened indoors and around the outer edges of the maps - enough of them didn't for me to be uncertain about that theory though.

System specs:

Windows 10 Pro 64-bit COEM edition
Intel(r) Core(TM) i7-4820K CPU 3.60 Ghz
16,0 GB RAM, Kingston, custom timings
Gainward Geforce 770 (2 GB VRAM), driver version 375.86

A thing to note about the crashes is that they aren't immediate. The screen output freezes, but I can hear the game reacting to my input. I'll hear walking, menu or UI sounds for a few more seconds until I guess Windows realizes it's not receiving enough event cues from the program.

That's all the info I have. Thankfully I am able to play on Stalker without losing too much progress on every crash because I seem to get hurt a lot. Free save every time. :B

Edit: the crashes seem to no correlation to the memory usage. At the time of crashing it can be a few hundred MB or 1-2 GB. It can happen two minutes into a fresh game or an hour or so.

TLD_2016-12-07_124338.rar

DxDiag.txt

Edited by ThatDearGuy
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I *think* the bug occurs less often during hours I go through loading screens frequently (although it again does not explain why I crashed in the Riken so often). Perhaps dumping cache or scripts being reinitialized makes the problem disappear temporarily?

Update: after extensive testing I no longer think this is the case. It may simply depend on the interior space itself.

Edited by ThatDearGuy
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I am having the same problem. In particular, the screen output freeze but sound continuing for some time. Probably happens on average once every two hours of real life play time, which as I'm sure you know is frustrating after walking across a zone without a save initiating. 

Will post specs and logs when I'm home from work.

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As promised, my specs:

Quote

Windows 10 Home 64-bit

Intel Core i5-4440 CPU 3.10GHz

8.00 GB RAM

AMD Radeon R9 200 Series

 

And my logs are attached (will add more as crashes occur).

Thanks for any insight!

 

121316 JM crash log 1.txt

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On 14.12.2016 at 4:10 AM, JethroMoney said:

As promised, my specs:

 

And my logs are attached (will add more as crashes occur).

Thanks for any insight!

 

121316 JM crash log 1.txt

Nice to hear someone else has this, hope you get more crash logs than I do. I was wondering today if it might be GPU driver related, but seeing as how you are using a Radeon and I have my Geforce, I think I can cross that possibility off the list.

Wanted to add one more observation to the list: the crashes seem to no correlation to the memory usage. At the time of crashing it can be a few hundred MB or 1-2 GB. It can happen two minutes into a fresh game or an hour or so. Totally random.

Edited by ThatDearGuy
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I think I may actually have permanently become stuck due to this bug. On Interloper, I have to walk from Coastal Townside all the way to the basement in Old Island Connector to reach an opportunity to save. Higher difficulty means fewer houses and chances for me to save (also the loading screen between the two world spaces apparently doesn't count as a save point). Crash keeps happening within 5-15 minutes after walking and it's not enough for me to reach the basement.

If I can't get to the Riken, it's basically over.

Thoughts, Hinterland?

Edited by ThatDearGuy
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I tried another eight or so attempts to walk to that basement, but I just can't get there due to these weird delayed crashes. Instead I tried something different. In the other thread I linked to, I mentioned getting this crash a lot in The Riken. I just wanted to go back there now and confirm that. I loaded a game into Desolation Point to test this further.

Outside of the Riken, I do occasionally get the delayed crash within (real) minutes or even seconds, mixed in with the 30 (real) minutes to two hour crash-free periods. However, inside the Riken this seems to be almost *exclusively* the case. I reloaded inside The Riken roughly fifteen times, and only once was I able to run through it, check all the containers and exit. Three times I crashed within ten seconds, seven times I crashed after a (real) minute or so, the rest all occured within the following 2-3 minutes.

Whatever is causing these crashes really seems to take to The Riken, so I suggest we start there. Still willing and able to run diagnostic tools.

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My suggestion would be trying to run the game in DX9 mode - You can test this by opening the games location (Right click the game in steam- go to properties->local content->browse local content) then run the force_dx9 batch file you find in the install directory.

Your log shows a lot of DX11 errors when it crashes, so I'm assuming your video doesn't fully support DX11.

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It's a Geforce 770. Not the latest model anymore, but it shouldn't really have any issues with DX11. Works fine in other, much more resource demanding games.

I will test DX9 for now, but if there is anything I can do to help with 11, please include me.

Edit: also read the other thread I posted last week. I think it may lie closer to the core of the matter.

 

Edited by ThatDearGuy
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Hmm, that's true - sorry didn't spot the card version. The error does suggest otherwise though - what driver version are you on? DX9 should still be the solution to the errors... but I don't know exactly why it's throwing that error. I have passed on the crash dump to our engineers though to see if they can track anything else down. 

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Also might be worth mentioning to these engineers that by *far* the most updates never produce crash logs. Again, see the other thread.

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Updated drivers again to current. No change. It can happen anywhere, but I still get the impression it tends to happen more frequently in high FPS areas, like interiors. Memory usage has no angle on it.

 

I've been trying to cross the mines between Pleasant Valley and Coastal Highway, but I've crashed a dozen times in a row, just before exiting. I'm moving slow because I'm carrying a lot of coal. It is trying my patience a little.

Edited by ThatDearGuy
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Posted (edited)

I've been going over my older posts again and I seem to have not been very conclusive about running the game in DX9.

DX9 definitely helps with stability, but it's not a complete solution either. It still happens. My best guess is DX9 reduces the likeliness of the exact same type of crash happening to an order of 20/30 (DX11 consistently crashes at least once an hour, so it's fairly easy to estimate). It's still terribly random. I did manage to get the 500 day badge last weekend, so should have some idea of what I'm talking about.

Again, memory usage has no real angle on it. High FPS seems to increase the likelihood though (running the game on an GSync monitor, so I never have VSync turned on). The game just hangs without crashing, while the sound of actions, moving and using menus, persists for a short while. Alt-F4 usually doesn't work unless the game was recently started. The task manager is the only thing that can kill the process.

Edited by ThatDearGuy
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So first thing that comes to mind based off your new info is, what are you video card temps at? Do you ever notice a message from windows stating that the video card has crashed? 

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Posted (edited)

Bit of new info here. In a rare display of generosity, the game saved *after* the freeze occured. I basically froze right in front of the door leading to the main hydro dam building. Per usual, the game kept on working for some moments, even though the screen output froze. I was able to blindly load into the new area and auto-save. When I reloaded the game, the save was still intact. Pretty neat!

 

On 7.3.2017 at 10:40 PM, Support said:

So first thing that comes to mind based off your new info is, what are you video card temps at? Do you ever notice a message from windows stating that the video card has crashed? 

I don't know, but a temperature alarm should have gone off it it was a problem at any point. I'll keep an eye on it either way, maybe I haven't configured that setting properly. I feel an overheating crash should be accompanied by GPU artifacts and system-wide crashes, but I haven't seen any of those yet. I'll keep you posted.

Reminding you again that other games running Unity don't seem to have this issue.

Edited by ThatDearGuy
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Posted (edited)

I noticed a sharp temperature increase in areas with very little geometry. With GSync's variable refreshrate enabled, I'm guessing those areas actually become quite taxing, workload-wise. I saw it rise from cold 50C to 75C in outdoor areas and in the upper 80C in these small areas. I will still occasionally get crashes in outdoor areas too, but I suppose it's possible the temperature builds up over time.

Still have some problems with the idea that overheating is the issue.

  • There are no visible GPU artifacts
  • The freezes/crashes affect the program, not the system
  • GPU shouldn't hit into issues until it takes another 20C to a grande total 80C-100C. I haven't seen that happen yet.
  • NVidia's drivers are very keen on alerting me on any kind of problem, typically after it has occured. I never get any notification of that.
  • They have happened in 75C outdoor areas, though not as often.
  • TLD is the only Unity game that seems to be affected.
  • High FPS still doesn't explain properly why the problem is less likely to occur in DX9 mode. If anything the simpler GPU workload would result in even higher FPS.

Does Unity have any interesting quirks running games at very high FPS?

 

Edited by ThatDearGuy
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Okay, I just experienced a freeze/crash at 73C, outdoors. Overheating definitely can't be it.

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There's no way for me to limit FPS with GSync, so for the time being I'm enabling VSync and testing if that improves stability under DX11. It takes a little getting used to, my eyes can definitely tell that the fps is locked at 60. GPU temperature is locked at 73C in interiors with little geometry. Played about 10 minutes so far without crashes, not really indicative.

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Posted (edited)

I played the game for something like 6 hours over the weekend on DX11 with VSync enabled. No crashes. As far as workarounds go this will do for now, but my eyes are noticing the differences with screen tearing and such. I'd like to have it back, but I'm not going to push the issue further.

For comparison, I did a few more test. Vsync disabled and Gsync enabled for all tests.

  • Minecraft, 140 FPS at about 78C. No crashes, tested it for an hour.
  • Mass Effect 1, DX8/9, 100+ FPS at about 80C. No crashes.
  • Alien Isolation: DX11, 62 FPS at about 83C. No crashes
  • Kerbal Space Program, 64 bit, also Unity engine, 140 FPS (in space, using a small craft) and assumably DX9. No crashes.
  • Kerbal Space Program, 32 bit, also Unity engine, 140 FPS (in space, using a small craft) and assumably DX9. No crashes.
  • The Long Dark + NVidia stress test tool, 91C, FPS 25-30, DX11. No crashes for two hours.

Conclusion, the problem is currently specific to The Long Dark and very high framerates. Even forcibly overheating the GPU doesn't force a crash with any of these games. Unity may be a factor, but I don't own enough Unity engine games to tell for sure. KSP works fine in 64 and 32 bit, but I don't think it uses DX11. I don't own any other Unity games that run DX11, so I am unable to test that further.

I pinged my contact at NVidia. I was one of the first people to test a GSync screen, they have always been interested my in feedback as a result. They're usually very interested in learning about issues with relatively new tech, but It's been a while since we spoke and GSync isn't the latest of the latest anymore. High frequency monitors however are very commonplace, even if there's no GSync technology in them. If anyone would know if this is a common issue with Unity games, it would be NVidia.

I don't know when or if I'll hear back from him though, you might want to do a little inquiring on your own.

Edited by ThatDearGuy
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I experienced the first freeze-crash while having my GSync hardware disabled in favour of vsync software. It happened in the main game menu of all places, which I thought was interesting. The little 3D backdrop with the cabin definitely constitutes a high FPS area, which seems to complement my earlier findings. It indicates one of two possibilities, either vsync does not work in the main game menu (you wouldn't notice since the perspectives never moves), or it the high FPS crashes are merely masked by enabling vsync, making them at the locked 60 FPS still a rare occurence, as opposed to a frequent one at 140 FPS.

I know I'm just logging my findings at this point, but I hope you can do something with all my posts here. If not, other perhaps other gamers with high-end hardware coming across the same issue will find some use for it.

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Posted (edited)

And now I've experienced my first actual in-game (as opposed to the game's main menu) crash with vsync enabled. Granted, it took a *lot* longer to show, but it did eventually happen at the locked 60 FPS.

 

There is a definite correlation between high FPS and the occurences of these crashes that has nothing to do with overheating. Worth looking into.

Edited by ThatDearGuy
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Posted (edited)

It crashed again (using vsync locked at 60 fps) and this time it produced the first crash log in three and a half months. Very curious. Maybe the very high FPS crashes means the logs aren't always saved somehow?

Whatever the case, check them out. The game had only been running for a very short time when it crashed in Coastal Highway.

error.log

output_log.txt

crash.dmp

Edited by ThatDearGuy
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Thanks for posting the crash logs - The reason they are created or not created for that matter has nothing to do with frame rate, to be honest. Has more to do with how the crash occurs and if the engine can create a dump. This would suggest it's not the same crash. I will get these out for review by the team. 

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