Decay rates on food

[Czechintocash]

i can't seem to find current decay rates for food. I'm more interested in canned goods, jerky, mres things like that. Help?!? 

[TROY]

I saw a post recently indicating that decay rates are based on a 1000 day timer. I havent tested that, and I'm not sure how the difficulty setting affects it, if at all. If it holds true, then the remaining days til complete spoilage of any packaged food found can be calculated by simply adding a zero to its current condition. 

[Czechintocash]

1000 days is what i thought it was. But is there anything that doesn't decay? I believe I remember at one point jerky and mres didn't decay. 

[Dirmagnos]

Right now everything decays.

Raw meat is fastest(cooked meat lasts a bit longer), things like MRE are slowest. Slowest decay rate(for meat at least) is outside(like storing in car trunk; but its still fairly fast, so its not frozen or anything), followed by storing inside, followed by storing in player backpack(with no apparent reason food tend to spoil fastest when carried by player).

[Drifter Man]

This is my current list, but it is all work in progress. The difficulty is Voyageur.

Note: Where the result is marked with an asterisk, it means that the item has degraded by less than 10% over the test period and the result is very inaccurate.

 

• Meat decay (%/day)   outdoor, open   outdoor, container
• -------------------------------------------------------
• venison, cooked      0.8             0.8
• rabbit, cooked       1.0             1.0
• wolf, cooked         0.8             0.8
• wolf, raw                            2.8
• venison, raw         1.6             1.6
• rabbit, raw                          2.7
• -------------------------------------------------------

 

• ---------------------------------------------------------------
• Food decay           backpack  indoor    indoor    outdoor  
•                                container open      container
•                      %/day     %/day     %/day     %/day
• ---------------------------------------------------------------
• beef jerky                     0.075     0.076
• candy bar                      0.189     0.177     0.020*
• cattail stalks                 0.000*         
• condensed milk                 0.775               0.197
• dog food                                           0.147
• energy bar                     0.675     0.664     0.337
• granola bar                    0.256               0.030*
• herbal tea           0.038*    0.051     0.045*    0.045*   
• military-grade MRE             0.043*    0.038*    0.020*
• soda                           0.126     0.133     0.675
• peanut butter                                      0.400
• pinnacle peaches               0.256    
• pork & beans                   0.098               0.547
• salty crackers                 0.000*    0.000*
• tin of coffee        0.066     0.075     0.076     0.069*
• tin of sardines                0.052*    0.061*    0.257
• tomato soup                    0.150    
• ---------------------------------------------------------------

 

• ---------------------------------------------------------------
• Decay of clothes     constant  indoor
• Duration: 69-84 days wearing   container
•                      %/day     %/day
• ---------------------------------------------------------------
• basic boots                    0.083
• wool scarf           0.467     0.083
• deerskin boots       0.310
• deerskin pants       0.107
• heavy wool sweater   0.131
• jeans                          0.036*
• rabbitskin mitts     0.417     0.077
• toque                0.507     0.101
• wolfskin coat        0.155
• wool longjohns       0.071
• wool socks           0.440     0.083
• ---------------------------------------------------------------

 

• ---------------------------------------------------------------
• Other items          backpack  indoor    indoor    outdoor
•                                container open      container
•                      %/day     %/day     %/day     %/day
• ---------------------------------------------------------------
• accelerant           0.121     0.150     0.152     0.149
• distress pistol flare          0.051               0.053*
• antibiotics          0.060     0.074     0.076     0.079*
• painkillers          0.060     0.074     0.076     0.079*
• water purif. tablets 0.129     0.144     0.152     0.149
• ---------------------------------------------------------------

 

• ---------------------------------------------------------------
• Bedroll decay        used      indoor
•                      +backpack container
•                      %/day     %/day
• ---------------------------------------------------------------
• bedroll              1.424     0.148
• ---------------------------------------------------------------

[Doc Gonzo]

Drifter,  Fascinating stuff man.  Am I reading the part about harvested meat correctly?  Those items decay slightly fast in a container outdoors verses outdoors without a container?  It also seems I'm better off putting some of my coffee in my backpack.

 

As always, thank you.   

[Drifter Man]

6 hours ago, Doc Gonzo said:

 

Drifter,  Fascinating stuff man.  Am I reading the part about harvested meat correctly?  Those items decay slightly fast in a container outdoors verses outdoors without a container?  It also seems I'm better off putting some of my coffee in my backpack.

 

Actually, meat seems to decay at the same rate outdoors whether it is in a container or not. The difference you see is due to error in the "measurement" - since I only record percent and days (as integers), there can be some inaccuracy in calculating the decay rates. It gets smaller as the period over which the measurement is taken gets longer. I decided to delete the numbers for raw meat that didn't match, because I see they can be misleading. I've also brought the table up to date with my latest records.

However, I confirm that some items decay at a slightly slower rate in the backpack: coffee, tea, antibiotics, painkillers, water purification tablets and accelerant.

Condensed milk, candy bars, granola bars, MRE (probably), energy bars are best stored outdoors.

Soda, pork and beans, sardines are best stored indoors (my guess is that the same goes for tomato soup and pinnacle peaches).

There seems to be no dramatic difference between in- and out-of-container storage, only between indoor and outdoor storage.

[Scyzara]

On 1.8.2016 at 9:09 PM, Dirmagnos said:

Right now everything decays.

There are some exceptions, though: Cattail stalks, Salty Crackers and preboiled cups of tea / coffee don't decay at all afaik.

[TWM]

So I the other day I cooked up some wolf meat in a cave and stored it in a container within the cave. When I returned the other day, the quality seemed to have dropped a couple of percentage points, wheras the cooked bear meat I store outside on the ground next to a house elsewhere seems to stay at 100% for days on end.

I'm assuming then that a cave doesn't count as an outside location, since the temperature is higher than outside?

By the way, do blizzards still make the temperature drop within caves? Cave temperature seemed to fluctuate at some point depending on how cold it was outside, but that effect seems to have been significantly reduced.

I'm playing a challenge mode that is on voyageur difficulty level as far as I can tell (no trichinosis from animal meat, but animals do attack me, or try to anyway...), so I don't know if and how that factors in.

[Drifter Man]

9 hours ago, TWM said:

I'm assuming then that a cave doesn't count as an outside location, since the temperature is higher than outside?

By the way, do blizzards still make the temperature drop within caves? Cave temperature seemed to fluctuate at some point depending on how cold it was outside, but that effect seems to have been significantly reduced.

The inside part of a cave doesn't count as an outside location. I didn't check decay rates there, but the hours spent there resting definitely don't count towards "hours rested outdoors" in the journal. Inside the cave you get a fixed temperature bonus (9°C, I think) that is added to outside air temperature, so the temperature fluctuates.

Note that this isn't true for the area close to cave entrance (which has no temperature bonus but at least shelters you from the wind) and for large caves with loading screens (which have fixed air temperature, I think).

[Thurman Merman]

Drifter, good stuff, thanks.  What was your test period (days)?  I've run a few smaller tests (~50 days) solely on indoor food storage and come up with similar (but slightly different in a couple of cases) results.

[Drifter Man]

4 hours ago, Thurman Merman said:

Drifter, good stuff, thanks.  What was your test period (days)?  I've run a few smaller tests (~50 days) solely on indoor food storage and come up with similar (but slightly different in a couple of cases) results.

It is 254 days for food items stored in an indoor container except energy bar and condensed milk, which didn't survive that long.

I can actually show screenshots from Days 587 and 841 that I used (the condensed milk in the second picture is not part of the test, it's another sample):

[Thurman Merman]

254?!! Oh, wow!  Thanks.  I'm not even gonna ttake the time to track them anymore.

[Thurman Merman]

Oddly, as I posted in another thread, I just found a peanut butter at 95% on day 52 (or 53) and a milk at 93%.  If everything starts decaying when the sandbox is created, then that shouldn't happen.

 

[Thurman Merman]

After thinking about this a while, perhaps less efficient foods (i.e., lower calories/Kg) should generally lasted longer than more efficient foods.  Currently, you'd almost always take crackers over Pork and Beans or Jerky over Tomato Soup - you get more calories for less weight giving up only the possibility of gaining a heating bonus.  

It would be a tougher decision if those heavy Pork and Beans, for example, lasted longer than those lighter Crackers (which would also be more realistic -  in my experience, crackers, despite being salty and heavily processed go bad in a few months - smell awful - whereas canned goods not exposed to high temps last indefinitely).  I'm thinking of this as I sit in the mountaineers hut gorging on canned goods and peanut butter while my crackers sit in the hatch not degrading.   Just kind of thinking out loud.

Also, more on topic, and in line with my prior post, degradation does not seem to be at a constant rate across all maps starting on the creation of the sandbox (as I thought it did).  I'm on day 115ish, and have recently found milk and Peanut Butter in 85+ condition at TWM.  

[CuteBeaver]

According to the guide on steam the Milk should have lost 23% of its condition. So it would have been 77% under ideal conditions. I really wish we could know for certain the exact numbers or at least be given a description on the object where best to store it. By any chance did you pull this out of the sealed containers on the mountain? There may be special looting rules we don't know about based on container type. It may not be the map..

Maybe we should start testing container types for storage?. I'm not sure but in the past it was a widely held belief the red first aid boxes would slow match decay. I ponder maybe if certain types of storage containers are helping. On steam some people were claiming fridges were better, ect.

 

[elloco999]

On 22-8-2016 at 9:08 PM, Thurman Merman said:

in my experience, crackers, despite being salty and heavily processed go bad in a few months

Funny, I have eaten crackers that were years past their expiration date and those were fine. And tasted good too. Guess it all depends on what type of crackers we're talking about...

[Thurman Merman]

3 minutes ago, elloco999 said:

Funny, I have eaten crackers that were years past their expiration date and those were fine. And tasted good too. Guess it all depends on what type of crackers we're talking about...

Probably due to whatever fat/oil is in them.  And the extent to which they were exposed to higher temps.  It's hot where I live.

[Rifleman]

I hate the lifespan of meat. It's unrealistic and annoying so I made a topic about it.

 

[Thurman Merman]

On 8/25/2016 at 9:15 AM, Rifleman said:

I hate the lifespan of meat. It's unrealistic and annoying so I made a topic about it.

 

It's not as bad as everyone states, IMO.  Generally, assume you harvest venison at 75%.  Throw it in the snow - it will decay at roughly 2%/day.  So, in 12 days you have venison at 51%.  Cook it.  It will be at 99%.  Throw it back in the snow.  It will decay at roughly 1%/day.  So, 49 days later, it's still at 50%.  So 61 days after you shoot it, it is still edible regardless of your cooking skill.  61 days is a long, long time in TLD.

Also, I have noticed that food decay rates are not as simplistic as I had assumed (all items begin to decay at a fixed and uniform (per item type) rate when the sandbox is created).  I just passed day 200 on my Stalker run and still have canned goods in the 70s and MREs in the mid 90s. 

[Rifleman]

8 hours ago, Thurman Merman said:

It's not as bad as everyone states, IMO.  Generally, assume you harvest venison at 75%.  Throw it in the snow - it will decay at roughly 2%/day.  So, in 12 days you have venison at 51%.  Cook it.  It will be at 99%.  Throw it back in the snow.  It will decay at roughly 1%/day.  So, 49 days later, it's still at 50%.  So 61 days after you shoot it, it is still edible regardless of your cooking skill.  61 days is a long, long time in TLD.

Also, I have noticed that food decay rates are not as simplistic as I had assumed (all items begin to decay at a fixed and uniform (per item type) rate when the sandbox is created).  I just passed day 200 on my Stalker run and still have canned goods in the 70s and MREs in the mid 90s. 

It's still unrealistic.

[Thurman Merman]

6 hours ago, Rifleman said:

It's still unrealistic.

But, it's also unrealistic that I can fall off a cliff, sprain an ankle, pop some aspirin and be gtg.  Or that I fight off a couple of wolves, slap on a band-aid, and am ready for more.  Or that my guy never needs to pee.  In a video game you want unrealistic concepts to represent realistic dilemmas in a way that makes the game as a whole challenging and fun.  If I could get 50kg of meat from these monstrous deer, and then freeze it in a car trunk indefinitely, what would my survivor do the other 49 days?  After trying to collect all types of food and track food decay over my last 200 day run, it seems pretty well balanced - if anything, food is still far too available.  Once you're up and running, your chances of starving are practically nil. 

[Rifleman]

18 hours ago, Thurman Merman said:

But, it's also unrealistic that I can fall off a cliff, sprain an ankle, pop some aspirin and be gtg.  Or that I fight off a couple of wolves, slap on a band-aid, and am ready for more.  Or that my guy never needs to pee.  In a video game you want unrealistic concepts to represent realistic dilemmas in a way that makes the game as a whole challenging and fun.  If I could get 50kg of meat from these monstrous deer, and then freeze it in a car trunk indefinitely, what would my survivor do the other 49 days?  After trying to collect all types of food and track food decay over my last 200 day run, it seems pretty well balanced - if anything, food is still far too available.  Once you're up and running, your chances of starving are practically nil. 

And that's why this game is in alpha. There are a lot of things that are unrealistic but the food lifespan on meat bugs me the most.